Degenerative Knee (Bone on Bone) Will Regenerate

1/12/2012

This post was written by Matt Whitehead, Director of the Egoscue Portland. Clinic and is an excerpt from a blog post from Egoscue Nashville. The client xrays were provided to Egoscue Portland by Egoscue Austin clinic.

Xrays of Degenerative Knee & Cartilage Damage - Before & After Posture Alignment using The Egoscue Method.

When people hear “bone-on-bone” (knee, hip, wrist, ankle etc.) most people (including well-meaning doctors) think “it’s too late to do anything, time for a replacement.” This line of thinking comes from the idea that our bodies are like machines. “When your cars’ brakes are worn-out you need to replace the brake pads with new ones and then your car is back to normal.” There are two problems with this line of thinking:

1. We have yet to (and probably never will) “build” a replacement part that is close to and as good as the original part (but medical science will never stop trying)

2. Machines are dead and our bodies are living – meaning we are able to rebuild our own parts at the rate of 500+ billion new cells a day!

When not replaced, the worn-out brake pad on your car will continue to wear away every day because the car does not have a means to repair/rebuild it on it’s own. But our bodies do! Our bodies are constantly repairing and rebuilding everything from our skin (we have all seen this happen after a cut or scrap) to our bones (observed in people who have healed a broken bone or raised their bone density) to muscle tissue, brain cells, nerve cells, cardic muscle, and even cartilage. The key to getting that “bone-on-bone” joint to repair itself is to make sure the reason why the joint was wearing away in the first place is corrected. That has to do with the postural position of the joint and the dysfunctional movement that has been happening. Correct that and the body will repair itself.

John Elder of Egoscue Nashville talked about Pete Egoscue and cartilage in a recent blog post:

When Pete released (his book) Pain Free back in the early 90s, he made the claim that you can regrow cartilage and took a LOT of heat for saying so. Everyone thought he was crazy and dismissed his theory. If you don’t have a copy of Pain Free, here is what he has to say on page 107:

“As for the ‘irreversible’ cartilage loss, why of all the tissue in the body would the cartilage be the only one that does not regenerate? The answer is that it does regenerate. Laboratory experiments in Sweden have shown that under the right conditions cartilage, like any tissue, can be grown. Moreover, sports medicine practitioners have long recognized that athletes increase their cartilage density and shock-absorbing capacity during proper training.”

Once again, he was crucified for this statement. In his own words from Pain Free for Women he says, “That statement drew a barrage of criticism from doctors, researchers, and physical therapists. When cartilage is gone, they scolded me, it’s gone, and nothing short of a miracle will bring it back.”

Well, if it’s a miracle they want, then it’s a miracle they’ll get. Thanks to Rick Mathes in the Austin Clinic for providing these x-rays (read his full blog post about this client HERE). A client working with one of the therapists was told he had to have his knee replaced. Take a look at the first xray picture from April, 2004 and you’ll understand why the doc suggested it.

To help explain what you’re looking at, it’s as if you are facing this client. His right knee is on your left. Notice that on the far left hand side of the image there is decreased space between the femur (upper leg bone) and the tibia (lower leg bone). Loss of cartilage, right? I agree. This guy is surely headed for a knee replacement...or is he?

Take a look at the second set of x-rays from July, 2005, just a little over a year after the first were taken. Notice the uniform spacing between the femur and tibia. It’s a miracle! The cartilage is regrown! While I agree the cartilage is regrown, I don’t believe it necessarily qualifies as miraculous. Instead, I believe the client took charge of his health and put faith in his body that it can heal itself. What a remarkable difference, and all without going under the knife. When you switch from being symptom-focused (i.e. loss of cartilage and needing a knee replacement) to being cause-focused (i.e. why did the cartilage degenerate?), a lot can happen. Change the position of the knee joint, give the cartilage room to grow, and it will.

I love that there is finally ‘proof’ that Pete was right all those years ago. The body is an engineering miracle. It’ll heal itself if you just give it an opportunity. Keep moving!

Renee Fossati

7/17/2013 12:13:23 am

I would like to know more on bone regeneration

Barry

12/19/2015 07:16:39 pm

I have been told I need knee replacement because of cartilage bone to bone

Catee Ingwersen link

12/20/2015 08:05:18 am

Hi Barry,
Read through my replies to the other dozen inquiries concerning bone on bone diagnoses. Also I made this video which may help also. Many many people have bone on bone joints and do not have any pain. Clients come in with bone on bone pain and after working a bit, the pain reduces and or is eliminated.....gotta ask yourself....did the bone on bone magically correct itself or was the pain coming from muscle dysfunction that can be corrected.

https://youtu.be/O5_D4LZKrvo

If you still have specific questions after digesting all this info, please let me know.
Catee

Lorraine Parish link

1/24/2017 07:31:28 pm

My xrays show no cartilige in right knee.Just bone on bone.Dr.recomended knee joint replacement and I don't want to have it.Is there some way it can be made to regrow?my left knee is pretty bad also.

1/27/2017 07:06:01 am

Hi Lorraine,
Thanks for the question.
Please read further below, since your question is addressed numerous times from the same question.

Yikes, people want to know about this topic!!! This is by FAR the most asked question I get. I have answered your question and others in detail about regrowing cartilage, knee replacements etc. Keep reading down to the end .....you'll get your answer and more. :-)

1/29/2017 12:59:04 pm

I am doing some exercises and had synvisc injections dec.13 2016 .It helped.I guess I will get another in 6 months .

7/17/2013 04:21:56 am

Hi Renee,
There is a lot to say about Bone Regeneration. I'm not sure what information exactly you are looking for. I'll give a general response.

I'm assuming a bone has DEgenerated and you want to know about REgeneration. The body is a healing machine and quite an expert one. Western medicine believes the body needs chemicals and invasive procedures to heal the body but oftentimes this is a falsehood. The body needs the interferences to healing to be removed so the body can do what it does best which is heal.

First, the reason or cause for the DEgeneration has to be established before an approach for REgeneration can be utilized. If a bone has DEgenerated due to overuse of steroids then the disuse of steroids would serve to stop the bone loss. If the body's chemistry and immune system is healthy then the body will rebuild what is lost. This process takes time and patience and proper biochemical and biomechanics support.

If the cause of bone DEgeneration is believed to be "old age" then the cause has definitely not been found at all rather it is ignored and the DEgeneration will continue and life will be more and more limited.

If by using our vision we watch the body in motion and in standing posture, we see that the limbs are not bearing the body's weight equally front to back and side to side, they are not functioning propery and there are wobbles and rotations in joints and areas that are not designed for such movements then there WILL BE friction. (The body does NOTHING without a reason.) Friction produces wear and tear, arthritis, stenosis, tendonitis, bursitis etc. Protective surfaces are worn down and next the bone starts to wear away. If we get rid of the interferences - wobbles and rotations and improper mechanical movements - then the friction can stop. The body's healing mechanisms can kick in, patience and support will be necessary.

Now, how does the bone Regenerate? The same way your body heals a cut to a finger using innate restorative capacities. Osteoblasts are doing their job to rebuild bone which is ONLY possible if the frictions are eliminated. Why are there frictions? Because muscles which are designed to hold a joint or limb or the skeleton in a certain healthy position for healthy pain free, frictionless operation have become imbalanced. Muscles on one side of the joint are too weak and too tight on the other side of the joint. (This is a very broad explanation but true none the less.)

Again, once the body parts have been balanced and FUNCTION without friction, the bone has a chance to REgenerate. But it has to be given that "chance" by eliminating the interferences.

Now, if the friction has been going on for far, way too long and the imbalances and real cause of the problem is overlooked or ignored, it is possible the bone and/or gaskets around the joints are so badly misshapen and damaged, the body part is "too" far DEgenerated. However if a joint is then replaced, it is crucial that the original muscle and joint imbalances be fixed. To ignore the cause and the muscle and joint imbalances will just produce friction in the next joint above or below the DEgenerated area. It's already started.

Please note I have numerous clients who have come in with diagnoses of bone on bone joints and severe pain. They think the bone on bone is causing the pain. It's not since the pain leaves sometimes in one session when the muscles are balanced and the friction and uneven pressures in the joints are eliminated.

I hope I have helped answer your question. Please let me know if you'd like more information or if I can help in some other way.

Tumay Sismanoglu link

4/26/2015 12:25:08 pm

Hi,
My question is: To grow hip bone (Femur) Is eburnated surface to be removed to start growing , or it does not have to be removed.
Tumay
tolmey4@gmail.com

Ann Singletary

9/22/2015 06:31:00 am

Is there any vitamins that will help regenerate the cartilage in my knee? Don't want to get a total knee replacement that was suggested by my Dr. Is there any exercise I can do at home to get my joints at an even balance?

9/22/2015 02:46:30 pm

Hi Ann,
Thanks for your question. There are no vitamins to replace cartilage. Based on my experience with hundreds of clients, biomechanics, musculoskeletal function/dysfunction and knee pain, cartilage wears down and away when muscles become imbalanced whereby changing the original proper position and healthy function of the bones of a joint. The bones of the joint no longer line up and fit together properly which creates uneven pressures and friction where there shouldn't be any long term.

The knee is an interesting joint since it is DIRECTLY a victim of how the hip joint is moving, the angle and position of the femur and what the ankle and foot are doing. In other words, if the joints above and below the knee are not functioning properly biomechanically, then the knee is in the middle of that stack of parts and basically has to move or twist based on how the femur and tibia/fibula are positioned and moving or not moving. By the way, the knee is a hinge joint and is not designed to twist and has very little leeway for rotation. Look in the mirror, is your ankle knee hip joint (in the crease of the leg in the front) all lined up straight and vertical or is your knee positioned outside or inside of the vertical line?

Many clients come in after knee surgery still in pain because the underlying problem: muscle imbalances in the joints above and below the knee. Many times the root cause of the knee problem has been fully ignored or overlooked.

Muscles via uneven tensions can and do move bones out of position and luckily can move bones back into the correct position with the right stimulus (Posture Alignment Therapy exercise program).

Another true fact to consider is this: many people have various bone on bone joints but they are NOT in pain.

Yes the only way to truly heal and reverse the problem is to identify the positional problems and all muscle imbalances and retrain those muscles to realign the bones/joints back into their optimal position. By the time any of the joints become bone on bone, the imbalance problem has been working on that joint for a while. This is not a one size fits all process nor one set of exercises and you're done. It's not hard it just takes commitment, time and effort. I strongly recommend finding a posture therapist certified in The Egoscue® Method. I offer Skype sessions if you can't find one of these therapists near you.

I hope my explanation helped. Posture Alignment Therapy consists of sessions with a therapist where you and the therapist identify the imbalances and issues and design a set of quite unique exercises you do at home over a period of time and return for subsequent sessions to get the proper alignment and out of pain. Cartilage can not regrow as long as there is friction inside the joint. The joint must be given the chance to reestablish cartilage and that can happen if you find someone who knows how to guide you through the process.

Laurie Wiersma

6/17/2017 04:27:35 pm

You said that the pain could be gone in the first session. What do u do in that session that takes the pain away? What kind of dr. would i go to have that done on my knees? I was first told that i needed an ankle replacement from several Dr's. I then went to another one and was told that I needed both my ankles and my knees rebuilt. I couldn't believe it. He said that nothing could be done so he was telling me i was going to live in severe pain the rest of my life and that I would be pretty much bed. Im only 44-year-old and i will not live like this much longer. I used to be very active person i exercised for hrs a day until I twisted my ankle while walking my dog's in the field. That's when all the problems started. I had previously broke both ankles like15 years before this. Never had any problems until many yrs later. Now i was told the arthritis has now taken all the tissue away in both my ankles and knees. The pain is unbearable. Is there anything u can tell me to do to get my life back? I live in Wisconsin and there aren't any Dr's that I can find to help me. Im exercising at the ymca in the water. Will that help? Please respond back because I can't live like this anymore. Thank you

Troy Erwin

8/23/2013 01:36:53 pm

I had a medial menisectomy and medial collateral ligament repair on my left knee in 1972. I am now 65 and occasionally (a couple times a week) experience what I think is bone on bone contact (very sharp pain in my left knee). I frequently work out using weights to strengthen the quads and hamstring muscles in an effort to strengthen the muscles around the knee. Is this damage repairable without a knee replacement? What should I do next?

8/24/2013 06:10:27 am

Hi Troy,
Great question. Logically, truthfully, I have no way of knowing if you need a joint replacement. I never advise my clients whether they should or shouldn't have surgery. :-)

I will however share with you what I do know given my experience with clients, biomechanics, musculoskeletal function/dysfunction and knee pain. The fact is the body operates as a unit. Meaning if one joint is mispositioned and its operating angle is misaligned then it is a matter of time before it creates drastic consequences in other joints in the body. Therefore, any changes to the proper length of any muscles in the body supporting any joints will lead to dysfunction in the chain of events producing movement at other load bearing joints (either or both shoulder, hip, ankle or knee joints) and will have direct effects on those other joints. Muscles move bone out of position and luckily can move bones back into the correct position with the right stimulus.

The key piece I see is you had muscle imbalance and joint dysfunction leading up to 1972 and maybe still have one. I say this since meniscus and collateral ligaments don't just tear, shred, wear away without a darn good reason. Uneven forces were coming down into the left knee joint from OTHER joint dysfunction, producing friction and wearing away those knee structures and some doctor went in and did some surgical cleaning house. That has held you over all these years. You have not fixed the underlying cause of the 1972 knee tears (UNLESS you tell me in younger years you were playing tackle football or hockey and you suffered a direct and devastating blow to your left knee).

Assuming you did not have such an injury, a posture (or positional joint) problem left unaddressed will over time create a bigger problem. The take away point, the golden nugget, is the knee (or any other joint) will continue to degenerate if the root cause is not addressed, until it's so badly degenerated and misshapen in the ball and/or socket that is WILL need to be replaced. The root cause is never OLD AGE unless we define old age as meaning you have ignored root causes and focused solely on the symptom.

Quads and hamstring strengthening alone don't make for a stable functional knee. Especially not if the muscles operating the ankle joints, hip joints, shoulder joints are imbalanced. The knee just goes wherever the hip and ankle tell it to go. This is where your efforts should be focused. Seldom is the place in pain the root cause. I see that over and over in my clinic.

Another true fact to consider is this: many people have various bone on bone joints but they are NOT in pain. Recently, a client (who was considering knee surgery) came in with bone on bone knee pain and after two sessions was out of pain. How could that be? If the bone on bone rubbing caused pain how could it not cause pain a month later? Because it was the position of the joint that was the real problem creating the pain not the bone on bone. We balanced the position of the joint by retraining the biomechanical operation of the muscles and the knee position returned to where it should be and the friction went away. The pain left. You see it is not the bone on bone, it is the position or misposition of the joint.

When a client comes in with knee pain, I record everything they say about the knee problem. THEN I take four photos of their posture and video them walking and we look at their entire body standing and in motion. They see some astonishing things they never were aware of because they are so used to their status quo they feel their movements are "normal" when the position and movement of their muscles and joints are anything but. If your knee is positioned inward or outward or your upper leg bone (femur) is rotating outward or inward or femur rotating one direction and low leg rotating the opposite direction or if the foot is pointing outward or inward then I'd say you can strengthen your quads and hams all day but you're not getting to the root cause.

I recommend finding a posture therapist trained in The Egoscue Method. You can check the therapist locations on www.appliedbiomechanicsassociates.com for one near you or Egoscue.com for a franchise clinic. You say you are having occasional pain which is your body telling you there's a problem. If the quad/ham strengthening alone is what your knee needs you wouldn't be having the pain something else is happening or not happening. You do have a choice and can try the non-invasive root cause approach before deciding about other interventions.

I hope my explanation helped. Send me some digital photos and if you can send a video of you walking and I'll tell you what I see. For the photos AND video: please wear shorts above the knees and either no shirt or a fitted shirt tucked in, no shoes or socks. I need four digital photos: front, back, right profile, left profile. Please have the photographer get as much of your body in the

8/24/2013 06:17:35 am

Troy, more on sending me photos:
Send me some digital photos and if you can send a video of you walking and I'll tell you what I see. For the photos AND video: please wear shorts above the knees and either no shirt or a fitted shirt tucked in, no shoes or socks. I need four digital photos: front, back, right profile, left profile. Please have the photographer get as much of your body in the frame as possible without cutting off feet or head. Most of all, do NOT pose or try and make yourself look good, just stand/move how you naturally stand/move. Video: stand in front of the camera and walk away from the camera about 12-15 steps then walk back toward the camera. Then have the photographer pan the video camera following you as you walk so the camera can record your right and left profiles crossing in front again while the camera follows your movements so I will be able to see your profiles in motion.
Posture4Life@gmail.com

John Price

12/9/2014 01:22:26 pm

please let me know where one can find this procedure?

Catee Ingwersen

12/10/2014 12:52:59 am

I strongly suggest seeking out a therapist with these credentials using a search engine like google. Search for these terms and include your city name and/or state:
Posture Alignment Therapist or Posture Alignment Specialist or Accredited Exercise Therapist certified by the Egoscue University in The Egoscue Method.
You can also search these sites for these specially certified therapists by zip code:
www.AppliedBiomechanicsAssociates.com
www.PTXTherapy.com

diane mundt

3/26/2015 01:07:15 pm

I am interested in knowing what to do with bone on bone knees. Because I DO NOT want to go thru surgery I would rather have a natural way of healing ! THANKS Can you please help with this it would be greatly appreciated!

3/28/2015 02:28:14 am

Do you have pain?
In a nutshell, my answer to "what to do with bone on bone knees" is: get yourself involved in The Egoscue Method. It will retrain your muscles so that the joints above and below your knee can start to function properly so the degeneration in the knee stops.

The problem with joint replacements is they don't replace muscles. And since muscles move, position and operate our bones and joints and knees, surgery does nothing to get muscles more balanced to operate the joint correctly. Having a new knee joint oftentimes leads to hip pain since the knee is a victim of what position the muscles of the upper leg and hip are holding it in and what dysfunctional muscle engagement patterns are going on at the hip and or ankle. So basically, you have knee pain/degeneration but the cause of that problem is most likely not knee function, it's elsewhere. (I base this on the large majority of clients w/ knee pain....of course I have not seen your body.)

If you live in Florida, come see me. If you don't, we can do Skype sessions. It is not a quick fix. It takes time, commitment and consistency. The photos of the bone on bone knee on my website shows 13 months worth of consistent work by the client. You can see the results. Some people get out of pain sooner and some it may take longer.

Questions? Let me know if I can help.

3/30/2015 06:02:45 am

I live in Iowa! So can I do the exercises to strenghen the muscles. Will this help straighten my structure. I HAVE ARTHRITIS AND MY HIP BONES ON MY X-RAYS ARE NOT EVEN, ONE IS HIGHR THEN THE OTHER. The nearest Egoscue is 4 and half hours away or more ... Once aligned straight will the cartilage regrow in the knees??????? And yes I would like as much help as I can get because I do not believe surgery is the answer!!!!!

Tumay Sismanoglu

9/22/2015 01:10:05 pm

Hi Catee,
The cause of my right hip joint is either; my left leg become shorter (12mm) 18 years ago when i had a trafic accident with compound fracture below knee, then i favored right leg, OR, when i had another accident in 2008 i receved some damage on my right hip cartilage then it slowly get degenerated over 2.5 years after accident. Catee, i can send some photo and video but, i feel it wont help you to diagnose the cause of my problem. It is on bone to bone, ican not walk proprly. I have been on cructhes last 3 years to avoid surgery. I am walking with single cructh (left arm) when i need arm/hand to do things around home. Now my spine curved and my hip is twisted and obiously this time my right leg become shorter. I think it is bit late to rectify the problem with posture correction.
I heard the doctor in Florida (Doctor Allen Dunn) does IAGH uses growth hormone to regenerate cartilage.
What do you think about that treatment? Is there any merit in to that.
Thank you

9/26/2015 06:34:44 pm

Hi Tumay
Not much to say without seeing you. You don't mention having pain.

There is friction inside the joint now --the friction will wear away any
injected or regrown cartilage. Unless you are going to regrow super duper
strong cement special cartilage you are going to wear away that too. Some
of my clients were surprised to discover that the pain went away even
though they are bone on bone after they retrained some areas to hold the
bones in a better position. So it wasn't the bone on bone that was causing
pain.

There is always an opportunity to balance imbalanced muscles in the other
areas of your body which helps improve center of gravity and provide more
muscle and joint balance where possible.
Let me know if I can help further.
Catee

Mary

9/30/2015 10:54:56 pm

Hi Catee,
I injured my left knee a year ago ( twisted) and 2,3 months after that I injured it again. pne time it was swollen so I had to take pills until inflamation went away. Now the result of MRI came :
1.Partial tear of the anterior cruciate ligament.
2.Complex tear of the medial meniscus extending from the posterior root attachment, through the posterior horn and onto the body. There is a vertical red zone component and horizontal longitudinal component which surfaces on the tribial side.
3. Almost complete loss of articular cartilage within the medial compament of the knee.
I am assuming that in my case the cartilage loss is due to inflamation. What do you reccomend I should do to regrow the cartilage? I have to see a recontruction knee specials but would appreciate your opinion first.

10/1/2015 03:01:30 pm

https://youtu.be/O5_D4LZKrvo

I hope this video answers your questions.

Catee

Krystal McCammon

7/26/2016 09:03:55 am

Hello,
I am 50 years old and my right knee is in dire need! I have had no injury that I know of in my past. When I was 41 I had a meniscus tear but have no idea how it happened. My knee started swelling and I was in a lot of pain. I had the tear repaired in Dec of 2007. My knee has never been the same. Since January of 2014 I have been getting a steroid shot every 6 months, however I have continued to get worse. My knee barely bends. I have to take stairs one at a time for lack of mobility. I have lost 50 lbs over the last 2 years. I love riding my bicycle. My orthopedic dr says that's the best thing to do and to keep it moving. But keeping my foot on the pedal has become a big issue! He says without a doubt I'll need a full replacement at age 55.
I have read the article above and I have starting looking for a posture therapist in my area but to no avail. How can I find out what I can change to see if I can regenerate my cartilage? I live in Madison Alabama.
Thank you for any advice you may have.
Krystal McCammon

Andrea Zeiner

1/2/2017 08:24:21 pm

That is upsetting the youtube video is no longer available due to a copyright claim.

1/3/2017 03:17:47 am

Hi Andrea,
What video are you looking for?

RMM

1/10/2017 08:38:58 am

Hi Catee, after reading some comments and watching your video, I have to ask a specific question about my issues.
I'm currently 56 y/o male and somewhat overweight. I was involved in an auto accident back in 1984. Suffered broken left leg that has a rod in it and the docs said I had some type of "chipped" back bone that was causing nerve damage to both legs. For the last 4-5 years my left knee has been increasing is severe pain. Going to the doc and x-rays showed that I have bone on bone osteoarthritis.
He said I was too young to have a replacement and to just get therapy and watch my diet. I did try some physical therapy that did no good.
After watching your video there's no doubt that my problem is a muscle imbalance probably caused by the nerve damage. The nerve dames is causing me to not be able to utilize quad muscles ( or any back of the leg muscles). I can't run or stand on my tip toes. I walk off balanced a lot of times. I strain to keep any type of good gait while walking. Laying down on my stomach, I cannot bend my legs up.
With this type of nerve damage, how would I go about correcting the imbalance if possible? Is there a good brace that would force proper alignment or do I need an experienced person like yourself to help me or am I just out of luck?
Also, if recommended, how do I go about finding someone with your knowledge and skill set in my area to help?
Thanks for your time in helping people.
Roger

1/10/2017 07:00:18 pm

Hi Roger
Thanks for the question. First perhaps it might be helpful for you (and a therapist) to know exactly what's going on with the nerve. Are you real sure there is a bone chip. And it has impaired both legs? And if there is could you get a nerve conduction study to verify the muscles are or aren't getting nerve supply? Just a few ideas.

Can nerve damage cause muscle imbalance? Yes. It shuts down or reduces the current to the muscle which can weaken and or atrophy.

However a muscle can weaken or atrophy from another muscle or muscles having developed a pattern of dysfunction because each muscle's length and tension are no longer what it needs to be. This pulls a joint or bone or bones out of alignment. Once the bones are no longer keeping their original proper position there will be Friction to bones cartilage ligaments tendons discs nerves etc. and other muscles will be forced to operate in ways they were not designed for.

Many times knee pain and other joint pain does not come from bone on bone. It comes from severe muscle imbalance. People with severe pain assume since they are bone in bone that's what's making the pain. But when they quickly get the joint or body in better alignment the pain is gone but the bone on bone is still there. It was the muscles that were creating pain.

That said it's important to not ignore the problem too long because if friction and imbalances continue for too long this will degrade and misshapen the components inside the joint.

The good news is (ahhhh the good news!) you have a number of other joints and muscles and structures above and below the knees and thighs that can be rehabbed and aligned to function better which will help you overall. But beware....be ready.

This therapy is for the serious dedicated person. It works if the client is in it to win it and will be able to stick with getting a number of sessions (it's seldom a one session or two session thing) especially with longstanding severe problems. One session can't get all parts balanced and working but each session is cumulative and builds on each other. Where do you live?

Roger

1/12/2017 08:33:43 am

Thanks for getting back to me Cattee. I didn't get notified of your reply so this morning I had to find your site again and then found your response. I'll bookmark and check back daily.
The bone that got chipped on my spine is what the doctor told me was the reason for the nerve damage. I've never really had any back pain. They did do some sort of testing and told me there would be no reversing this.
Yes, it is on both legs with the left a little worse than the right. And the left is where I have no cartilage left in the knee.
I've been trying to do some of the basic realign exercises but it is difficult for me to perform because of the nerve damage and not being able to hold or perform some of them.
The nerve damage has always affected my walking and ability to stop myself on slippery surfaces should I start to slip. This does make life a little more difficult but I am grateful I can still walk after that accident.
It has been a lot of years dealing with this and as I age I see things getting worse as far as my pain, the walking and balancing. I want to fix things as best I can so I can travel and go places with my wife.
I know your not a big fan of braces but maybe because of my unique situation might help. I've tried a few basic ones but they usually make the pain worse after a while. Maybe an unloader type or another one I was looking at was from www.inthegrovebrace.com. Their brace information says it will realign the muscles in the knee making them stronger.
I live in Vancouver, WA. I currently don't have any doctor or therapist working with me. Haven't seen either one in years.
Any suggestions or direction would be greatly appreciated. Thanks again for your time.

1/13/2017 10:08:04 am

Hi Roger, when you leave comments on my website, you can provide your email address in the box beneath where you provide your name and be sure to click the box "Notify me of new comments to this post by email" beneath the Comments box you type in.

I think you should contact Matt Whitehead at OregonExerciseTherapy.com in Portland OR or the folks at Egoscue in Portland. It will be totally worth a phone conversation and go see them to discuss your situation and so they can SEE you. It is very hard to provide any kind of meaningful therapy or advice without photos or seeing you in person.

Also, a braced joint is a dying joint. That goes for any body part. The brace will hold the part immobile and make it much weaker and yes it might feel stabilizing but unless you have ZERO options, its not the best choice.

My advice is still get some current diagnostics to see what the current situation is with the chip. I mean get an MRI or xray not a verbal statement from a doctor. Get copies of the MRI, xray report.

Doctors say a lot of things. "You have arthritis and you will have to learn to live with the pain forever." And then the person does Egoscue and the pain is gone. Therefore the pain was not from Arthritis (arthritis is a symptom not a cause) and the person will not have to live with the pain. Again, doctors SAY and predict many things that never come to pass or maybe they do.

There may be ANOTHER reason for the weakness and not the chip on the nerve. My best advice is just go talk to Matt or Egoscue. They will most likely give you a free consultation and you might do a session with them and see how that feels. It would TOTALLY be worth the trip, inconvenience of a long car ride to check that out.
Catee

1/13/2017 02:21:03 pm

Thank you Cattee for your time and help. I'll look into those places and see what they can help with.

Egoscue Portland is only about a 40 minute drive from home and OET is even closer. Vancouver, WA is right on the border with Portland, OR.

I appreciate your time and research for me.

Take care,
Roger

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Sue Stewart

1/29/2017 03:41:37 pm

Hi Catee,
I have just discovered your site and am looking forward to information specific to my situation. I have been told by an orthopedic doctor that I have a bone on bone deterioration in my left shoulder which will require a full shoulder replacement. I obviously want to avoid surgery if at all possible. I have been researching, but much of what I find applies to knee and hip joints. But cartilage is cartilage and if your method works for knees and hips, do you also have success with shoulders? I have pain and loss of range issues.
I am very interested in hearing from you. Regards, Sue

1/29/2017 06:51:05 pm

Hi Sue,
Yes, bone on bone hip knee shoulder vertebrae etc. All of which do have cartilage and padding that will be worn down with friction FROM UNEVEN FORCES going through a joint. Meaning the muscles on the front of the shoulder and the rear of the shoulder have unequal tension and has twisted your humerus forward and that joint is NOT able to operate fully and without friction from the head of the humerus not being seated correctly in the center of that joint. And when you go to lift your arm or rotate it your humerus is most likely running into the clavicle and acromium process. If the muscles were balanced and had equal tension front to back the humerus would sit properly in the center of the socket and could rotate 360 degrees. No problem.

Joint replacements do not replace muscles.

Many people with pain and bone and bone discover that they get out of pain with the posture alignment process realizing the cartilage didn't grow back in 2-4 weeks time but the pain is gone. So it was the muscle imbalance that was causing the pain not the bone on bone.

I am currently working with a woman who came in with some torn ligaments in the shoulder. She overdid it on a weight maching at the gym and pow. Dr. said she should have surgery. I realize your situation is bone on bone.

She had the classic posture problems, rounded shoulders, elevated shoulder, rotated shoulder, Kyphosis of the thoracic spine,posterior pelvis. But when we really got into the therapy about the second session we discovered a scoliosis in her upper spine which rotated the ribs and created a bubble under her scapula. THAT WAS THE CAUSE OF HER SHOULDER ROUNDING, BAD POSITIONS, DEGRADATION AND LIGAMENT TEARS. SURGERY WOULD NEVER HAVE FIXED THAT.

Yes I work with a lot of scoliosis and this method does quite well with it.

If you are interested, give me your email or leave it on my voicemail and I'll send you a crazy picture of her upper ribs/scapula bubble.

If you never find and fix the underlying cause, the bone on bone is not a cause, you will have further problems. The shoulder is a victim of the spinal position and the spine just does what the pelvis tells it to do. The pelvis can be misaligned from ankle dysfunction. These are just a few examples of how each of the joints, structures moved by muscle pairs impact each other very very much. You see it is a waste of time to run around treating the place in pain because seldom is the place in pain where the cause is. There are over 600 muscles which move and position 200+ bones. Muscles are king over the joints and bones.

The posture alignment method and especially (!!) Egoscue University certified therapists excel in understanding, seeing and correcting these problems.

John

3/13/2017 08:19:55 pm

Hi great site and information im 25 have really bad knees from running on the treadmill last couple of years and a noise in my hips went ive been sat down for a period of time, done some research so i have gone vegan fruit juice mainly try get alot of nutrition ,also been doing some knee exericse where u put weights on the ankles and dangle your feet, so to help regenerate the cartilage i would be best going to get an xray then see Egoscue near my area, to allingn them ano it will take a year or more but im fine with that im a believer in what our body can do, thanks hope to hear from you soon.

3/19/2017 07:14:24 pm

Could you reply please?

3/19/2017 07:26:40 pm

John
I'm sorry but I guess I didn't see a question in your posting.

If you are asking if I agree with what you were doing then my reply is your muscles have memorized imbalance probably in the hips and pelvis (maybe hips pelvis ankles shoulders) and that is degrading your knee joints. I'm sorry but no amount of perfect nutrition can ever compete with torsion and angled knee joints from joints above and below with your body's weight every single step. Grinding and friction are going to win. Find a posture alignment therapist now.

Let me know if I missed the question or u want more info. There is a literal ton of info on this subject in the numerous posts and replies above.

3/20/2017 07:57:08 pm

Thanks for the reply Catee Ok so you recommend i go to a posture alignment therapist, should i go get xrays first to see how they are or go straight to the therapist as they proberly will do xrays also if i go for along time getting the right alignment should help rebuild the cartilage and its giving more space to rebuild if im correct, thanks any more info would be great love to learn more thank you catee

3/22/2017 11:03:35 am

https://youtu.be/O5_D4LZKrvo

Let me know if you have trouble opening this video about Knee Bone on Bone.

4/1/2017 06:46:53 pm

Hi catee about the knee would having the same therapy be able to help hips shoudler elbows thanks

4/1/2017 07:02:35 pm

Yes

john

4/2/2017 06:50:08 pm

Great thank you do you have any other way of contact incase i need to ask you more questions thanks. dont want to spam your great article

3/23/2017 06:01:23 pm

thanks ill give it a watch

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4/18/2017 04:39:20 am

4/18/2017 10:54:55 am

Google "Certified Egoscue University" plus your town, state or country and tell me if you find someone. There are not a lot of us out there. You may have to do Skype sessions which we do and many other therapists like us do too.

lizzy

4/21/2017 07:40:51 pm

Hello catee,

I live in and from New zealand.
Yes I also believe the body can heal it's self given the chance.
I am starting on the road to hopefully regerate my cartiledge in my ankel i shattered dec 2011.
I had sergery recenly in feb to remove a bone spir that had grown, and at the same time remove the screws and plates.
It is quite painful to walk on with ankel swelling up tremendiously.
the sergin being a sergin sees ankel fusein being the only way.
For me i dont believe it is for me as i have alot of movement, get told i am a little flexable.

I make and have bone broth daily and have now started taking Great lakes hydrolstate collegen gelitine.
Which I understand can help with the regeneration
Next step is for me to keep the weight off ankel so the cartilede can regenerate.
Have been looking in to a non weight bearing leg brace to hoefully aid in cariledge regeneration

Have also been looking into PEMF -tho i can't do that at the moment.

I have M.S. not bad and follow Dr. Terry Wahls

Thank you for mentioning Pete Egoscue will track down his book as i know i need to also focus on balancing my body - will also look on youtube to see if i can find some help on putting that into practice :)

Thank you again - it is so very positive to read and see that cartilidge can regenerate.
it is very much inline with my own thinking :)

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6/18/2017 06:48:50 am

Laurie W submitted this question:
You said that the pain could be gone in the first session. What do u do in that session that takes the pain away? What kind of dr. would i go to have that done on my knees?

LAURIE, I AM NOT A DOCTOR (thankfully). I AM A THERAPIST TRAINED AND CERTIFIED BY THE EGOSCUE UNIVERSITY TO USE A VERY EFFECTIVE THERAPY POSTURE ALIGNMENT METHOD. THIS METHOD IS FAR MORE EFFECTIVE THAN PHYSICAL THERAPY, SURGERY, INJECTIONS, PRP, STEM CELL, DRUGS.

DO AN INTERNET SEARCH FOR "EGOSCUE UNIVERSITY CERTIFIED THERAPIST" AND YOUR STATE. MANY THERAPISTS LIKE MYSELF CAN HELP PEOPLE VIA SKYPE WHEN THERE ARE NO THERAPISTS CLOSE BY.

SORRY FOR THE CAPS, JUST WANT TO DIFFERENTIATE YOUR QUESTION VERSUS MY RESPONSE.

READ THE ENTIRE ARTICLE ON DEGENERATIVE KNEE-BONE ON BONE I WROTE. READ MANY OF THE COMMENTS AND QUESTIONS I HAVE REPLIED TO. ALL YOUR ANSWERS ARE THERE.

PLEASE TAKE THE TIME NOW TO READ THE ENTIRE ARTICLE.

PEOPLE CONTINUE TO SUBMIT URGENT QUESTIONS AND STORIES OF PAIN AND SURGERY TO ME BUT I HAVE ALREADY ANSWERED THESE QUESTIONS OVER AND OVER ABOVE.

YOU NEED TO DO YOUR RESEARCH AND NOT HAND RESPONSIBILITY FOR YOUR OWN HEALTH AND PROBLEMS OVER TO SOMEONE ELSE ESPECIALLY ONE WITH A MEDICAL DEGREE TO SOLVE. FIGURE IT OUT YOURSELF, (READ THE ARTICLES FULLY) MANY OTHERS HAVE. MANY PEOPLE THINK THE DR KNOWS MORE THAN THEY KNOW OR A POSTURE THERAPIST KNOWS. THIS IS NOT TRUE. DOCTORS ARE LOOKING AT BONES/JOINTS. THEY DO NOT CARE NOR UNDERSTAND ABOUT MUSCLE BIOMECHANICS AND MEMORY. JOINT REPLACEMENTS DO NOT REPLACE MUSCLES! GET THE JOINT REPLACED YOU WILL STILL HAVE MUSCLE DYSFUNCTION. YOU HAVE 600+ MUSCLES PULLING AND HOLDING YOUR BONES IN BAD POSITIONS WHICH HAVE BEEN MEMORIZED. MUSCLES ARE KING. BONES/JOINTS ARE VICTIMS OF WHERE THE MUSCLES PULL THEM. NO ONE IS DOING THE AMAZINGLY SUCCESSFUL COMPREHENSIVE METHOD OF POSTURE ALIGNMENT BY THERAPISTS USING THE METHODOLOGY COMING OUT OF THE EGOSCUE UNIVERSITY.

I was first told that i needed an ankle replacement from several Dr's. I then went to another one and was told that I needed both my ankles and my knees rebuilt. I couldn't believe it. He said that nothing could be done so he was telling me i was going to live in severe pain the rest of my life and that I would be pretty much bed. Im only 44-year-old and i will not live like this much longer. I used to be very active person i exercised for hrs a day until I twisted my ankle while walking my dog's in the field. That's when all the problems started. I had previously broke both ankles like15 years before this. Never had any problems until many yrs later. Now i was told the arthritis has now taken all the tissue away in both my ankles and knees. The pain is unbearable. Is there anything u can tell me to do to get my life back? I live in Wisconsin and there aren't any Dr's that I can find to help me. Im exercising at the ymca in the water. Will that help? Please respond back because I can't live like this anymore. Thank you

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Grace

10/20/2017 06:20:42 am

Can anyone help me? I am 34 yrs old. I was diagnosed with osteoarthritis during the year 2005. My quadriceps muscles are wasted. During the year 2014, I fell down from the boat and got injured my arthritic right knee. I had undergone knee surgery for two times. One was during 2014 after the fall and was placed a plate and another was during 2015 (meniscal repair was done and the plate was removed) and again they suggesting me for surgery. Doctor told cartilage in my knee has been degenerated and there is no chance of regeneration of cartilage. He advised me to take steriod injections, or growth hormone injection or go in for surgery without giving me any hope. I am suffering from severe pain since 2014, feeling the even when i am sitting. In all postures i am suffreing the pain. My right leg is not straight now. Please suggest me what can be done. Is there any chance to get rid of this pain and regrowth of cartilage.
Grace S

10/20/2017 10:21:49 am

Hi Grace,
Dozens of people reading this article have asked the exact same or similar questions. The answers have been provided each time.

I would be duplicating the answers and explanations already provided above. Please read through everyone else's questions especially concerning cartilage regeneration and you will get your answers versus my taking time to repeat what has already been said many times and many ways.
Thank you
Catee Ingwersen

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Degenerative Knee (Bone on Bone) Will Regenerate

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